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Thread: Alfred 400% SATK calculation bug \ game mechanic

  1. #11
    Section Leader Nachteule's Avatar
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    Hello Alexander,

    thank you for making your thoughts more clear. But I think you have probably a wrong understanding of Acc'tan's lieutenant feature. The 20% DEF boost is

    1. permanent until end off battle
    2. stackable


    Stackable means that each activation adds to the previous ones. In case of Acc'tan a 20% bonus per activation means:

    0 activations: DEF0 (regular DEF value)
    1 activations: DEF1 = 1.2 x DEF0
    2 activations: DEF2 = 1.2 x DEF1 = 1.44 x DEF0
    3 activations: DEF3 = 1.2 x DEF2 = 1.73 x DEF0
    4 activations: DEF4 = 1.2 x DEF3 = 2.07 x DEF0
    5 activations: DEF5 = 1.2 x DEF4 = 2.49 x DEF0
    6 activations: DEF6 = 1.2 x DEF5 = 2.99 x DEF0

    In your video I counted 6 Acc'tan activations before Alfreds special is applied to Geoffrey. Therefore in your formulas

    Quote Originally Posted by Samyshkin Alexander View Post
    ...
    (ATK+50% + SATK+50%) - (DEF+20% + SDEF)
    ...
    you should consider (ATK+50% + SATK+50%) - (DEF+199% + SDEF) following your notation.


    The second thing is you wrote you expect Alfred's skill to behave like

    Quote Originally Posted by Samyshkin Alexander View Post
    ...
    (ATK+50% + 400%*SATK+50%) - (DEF+20% + SDEF) = dmg
    The question for me is why do you have this expectation? The english translation of Alfred says: "Vertical attack; causes 120% S-ATK damage upon hitting the target; its own accumulator won't be increased when attacked. The target will also be afflicted with a curse lasts one round; when the curse ends, the target will suffer a 400% S-ATK damage from the player casting the curse."

    The first part (causes 120% S-ATK damage) describes the regular special attack following the formula:
    [(ATK + S-ATK) - (DEF + S-DEF)] × ACC × Spec Mod = Damage Dealt
    with Spec Mod = 1.2 (from 120%) and ACC = 1.00 (from 100% no overcharge).

    Taking the Paint Coats and Acc'tan into account:
    [(1.5 x ATK + 1.5 x S-ATK) - (2.99 x DEF + S-DEF)] × 1.0 × 1.2 = Damage Dealt

    I think even with level 2 Paint Coats 2.99-fold DEF of a [+7] Protector can compensate 1.5 x ATK + 1.5 x S-ATK of a comparable weak attacker like Alfred.

    So what about the second part of the special description (when the curse ends, the target will suffer a 400% S-ATK damage)?
    Maybe the wording is not perfect but from programming point of view it's obvious to implement the curse similar to poison damage that means store special attack damage internally and use the value when the curse has to be applied. So a "400% S-ATK damage" means the damage from last special attack x 4.0 (400%). Don't forget "S-ATK" is in commander description used as synonym for the special attack and the Spec Mod.

    So why do you expect it your way of interpretation?
    Galactic Chairman
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  2. #12
    Four-Star Admiral Kris's Avatar
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    your calculation is wrong.

    You are doing 4 x the atk and its only 1.
    The maths isnt (ATK + SATK) x 4 but instead (ATK + SATK) the percentage doesn't make any difference.
    Geoffrys sheilds dont drop with your nornal attacks so you arent reducing any of his HP, but Acc'tan is using his DEF stack. As mentioned in my earlier post his DEF has risen so much that your attacks are a lot lower then his DEF.

    I dont know how you are getting 22 + 22 + 22 +22 = 400% because that is just wrong! it is instead is just ATK+(SATKx400%)

    EDIT:

    Even that calculation is wrong and after seeing Nachteule's reply he has got it right.

    The 400% SATK triggers on its own with no extra ATK....so my above calculation should actually be:

    ATK+(SATKx120%)
    SATKx400% curse detonation.
    Last edited by Kris; May 12th, 2016 at 09:52.
    Kris.s3 World 906
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  3. #13
    Section Leader Nachteule's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kris View Post
    your calculation is wrong.
    To which post do you refer?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kris View Post
    ...I dont know how you are getting 22 + 22 + 22 +22 = 400% because that is just wrong! it is instead is just ATK+(SATKx400%)
    Don't think Alfred is so hard to interprete how he is working. Trusting the battle equations from old forum a special attack damage of 22 is quite reasonable considering 6 activations of Acc'tan's skill and the curse is 400% of 22 which is 88.

    For why it is 22 damage I found a post in old Forum by Jane: http://www.tap4fun.com/forum/viewtop...25874&start=54 (Reading the whole thread is highly recommended!)

    {[(ATK + S-ATK) - (DEF + S-DEF)] × ACC × Spec Mod + Offset} × Crit%

    Offset = 22...24

    So if (ATK + S-ATK) < (DEF + S-DEF) the part of the formula in [...] is set to 0 I suppose (negative damage prevention). This nullifies ACC and Spec Mod, too (product with 0 rule). Only Offset remains and is multiplied by Crit% (Crit ATK value from commander statistics).

    Maybe this could be described better (more clear) in the commander description.
    Galactic Chairman
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  4. #14
    Four-Star Admiral Kris's Avatar
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    I wasn't referring to you Nachteule when I said your calculation is wrong, i was referring to Samyshkin Alexander.

    I the seconds part I was asking Samyshkin Alexander how he managed to come up with the idea that Alfred's SATK was worked out by 22+22+22+22.

    I should have clicked reply and that would have made it easier but i wasn't expecting you to reply to the comment so fast and reply before i did
    Kris.s3 World 906
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  5. #15
    Section Leader Nachteule's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kris View Post
    I should have clicked reply and that would have made it easier but i wasn't expecting you to reply to the comment so fast and reply before i did
    :-P

    (But I understand not using reply on large posts. Makes the thread harder read.)
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  6. #16
    One-Star Admiral Huu's Avatar
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    Geoffrey with lt. Acc'tan VS. Incendos, Geoffrehy, Ddarrien, FS (Seagal)

    19 round, 18 x activate acc'tan lt. skill


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I5Oyjg-QDgs



    next new commander skill
    - ignore target def
    - invisibility ignore or show invisible ships
    - ....
    -

  7. #17
    Destroyers ignore def so why didn't Incendos kill Geoffrey?

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Traveler View Post
    Destroyers ignore def so why didn't Incendos kill Geoffrey?
    I assume his hitpoint shield took the destroyer attack damage.
    ben42.s814 world 772 (Android)

  9. #19
    Super Moderator z3nithor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Traveler View Post
    Destroyers ignore def so why didn't Incendos kill Geoffrey?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ben42 View Post
    I assume his hitpoint shield took the destroyer attack damage.
    Yep. Basic game mechanics. At 1:34 he places a 2M shield, and then takes 66 total damage thanks to the +DEF, before Incendos S-ATK. No crit, so Incendos did less than 2M damage.


    At the start we see Dictator's Incendos deal 2,099,547 damage to Retrobot with no critical. Unfortunately, this is overcharged accumulator damage - Incendos has either R5 lv10 or 11, for 125 or 130 starting accumulator, meaning his non-crit S-ATK is going to be in the neighborhood of 1.65 million.
    time's up.

  10. #20
    Quote Originally Posted by z3nithor View Post
    Yep. Basic game mechanics. At 1:34 he places a 2M shield, and then takes 66 total damage thanks to the +DEF, before Incendos S-ATK. No crit, so Incendos did less than 2M damage.


    At the start we see Dictator's Incendos deal 2,099,547 damage to Retrobot with no critical. Unfortunately, this is overcharged accumulator damage - Incendos has either R5 lv10 or 11, for 125 or 130 starting accumulator, meaning his non-crit S-ATK is going to be in the neighborhood of 1.65 million.
    You are truly the wizard of this game

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